Coin Community Family of Web Sites
Royal Canadian Mint products, Canadian, Polish, American, and world coins and banknotes. Specializing in Modern Numismatics Vancouvers #1 Coin and Paper Money Dealer 300,000 items to help build your collection! Ken's Numismatic eBay Store US and World Coins, Bullion, and Exonumia. Coin, Banknote and Medal Collectors's Online Mall
Subscribe to our Youtube Channel! Check out our Pinterest!
Username:
Password:
Save Password
Forgot your Password?


This page may contain links that result in small commissions to keep this free site up and running.
Welcome Guest! Need help? Got a question? Inherit some coins?
Our coin forum is completely free! Register Now!

Vatican City 1973 50 Lira - And More

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.
Author Previous TopicReplies: 27 / Views: 1,106Next Topic
Page: of 2
Pillar of the Community
Bacchus2's Avatar
United Kingdom
2532 Posts
 Posted 02/07/2025  05:11 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bacchus2 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Hi again.

Thank you very much for your response. I appreciate the feedback and I'm happy to take any corrections. I keep doing passes of the page and finding things to fix. Everything is written in html from scratch which sounds impressive but you really only need to learn about 20 commands and then there is a lot of cutting and pasting and tweaking (which is how it's so easy for errors to creep in).

I find doing this has a number of benefits. It really forces (probably the wrong word) me to learn about the coin and look at the detail and the background of the imagery.

I can display the coins how I want, and include the details or links as I want as well rather than being forced into a preset template.

Being a website I can call it up on any device from anywhere and check what I have and don't have. It can be frustrating to be on a trip to a music festival at a Viking burial ground in Norway and an alert comes up that an auction site has a coin you might want and you need to check if you have it or not. Lets face it - we've all done it :)

Thanks also for pointing out that 1603 Quattrino. I hadn't in fact noticed that at all. Always a very nice surprise to find a bit of a scarce one. So many corrections to make...

Please do let me know if you have displayed your collection somewhere. I'm always happy to see others collections and learn something.
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
tdziemia's Avatar
United States
6895 Posts
 Posted 02/07/2025  08:01 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I'm barely organized enough to get my coins into 2 x 2 s before they get lost on my desk

But, using CCF's search function, it looks like we've never had a thread here devoted to posting and discussing Papal States coins (mostly we have one-off identification questions).

Might be fun to see (and discuss) what other members have, as you say, and also to discuss the historical context, which was constantly evolving.

I'll see if it makes sense to separately launch such a thread.
Edited by tdziemia
02/07/2025 1:55 pm
Pillar of the Community
triggersmob's Avatar
Australia
7619 Posts
 Posted 02/07/2025  09:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add triggersmob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Nice collection Bacchus2. Some of your KM numbers appear incorrect though. Same number against multiple coins and an extra 1 slipped in front of a few of the numbers, KM1147, instead of KM#147 etc. Not being picky, just want to help you make it best it can be.
View my Coins here, (NOW WITH OVER 16,800 IMAGES).... http://www.coincommunity.org/galler...hp?cat=10048
OFEC count = 237
Pillar of the Community
United States
1805 Posts
 Posted 02/07/2025  12:07 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Albert to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Keep in mind KM numbers do change among editions for the same coin.
And sometimes coins just don't appear or sometimes they are in different section.
Pillar of the Community
triggersmob's Avatar
Australia
7619 Posts
 Posted 02/07/2025  9:11 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add triggersmob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply

Quote:
Being a website I can call it up on any device from anywhere and check what I have and don't have.


Quote:
Please do let me know if you have displayed your collection somewhere. I'm always happy to see others collections and learn something.


That's exactly the reason I built my CCF gallery. Doesn't matter where I was, I could pull it up and see what I had. (it's maxed out now though, so I can't add any more)

Here's a coin I just played in the 20 questions game.
I note you don't have this one.
View my Coins here, (NOW WITH OVER 16,800 IMAGES).... http://www.coincommunity.org/galler...hp?cat=10048
OFEC count = 237
Pillar of the Community
Bacchus2's Avatar
United Kingdom
2532 Posts
 Posted 02/08/2025  04:50 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bacchus2 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
"Same number against multiple coins and an extra 1 slipped in front of a few of the numbers, KM1147, instead of KM#147 etc"
Thank for the heads up - yes there are a few errors there to fix.

"That's exactly the reason I built my CCF gallery. Doesn't matter where I was, I could pull it up and see what I had. (it's maxed out now though, so I can't add any more)"
That's a cool collection - I will take some time and peruse it.

"I note you don't have this one"
I'm pretty sure I do have it somewhere - I just haven't uploaded it yet. It's really the only example from a very short tenure - so interesting from that point alone. Yours is a very nice example.


"The more interesting types to me pre-date their incorporation into the Papal States in 1598"

I remembered I do have a page of European medieval coinage on my site (it's a bit of a warren I really have to sort out navigation better) - but there's only 1 "Italian" coin there.from the Viscounts
Galeazzo and Barnabo

https://diadumenian.com/Congressofp...0Europe.html






.
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
tdziemia's Avatar
United States
6895 Posts
 Posted 02/09/2025  4:27 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
One more edit, and one more attribution "assist"...

The first Innocent XII coin (the 1/2 bolognino struck in Bologna) has Background comments (on Gubbio) that perhaps were intended to go with the Innocent XI quattrino.

The Innocent XII 1/2 baiocco I believe is KM-53 (Gubbio) https://www.ngccoin.com/price-guide...duid-1497811
... and ND (undated). The undated variety has legend on the obverse ending in PONT MAX, which matches yours. The ones that bear a regnal year have legend like PON M A (year). As for the reverse, there is only one variant with the 4-line inscription as shown on Numista (Anno II). All the others have the 3-line inscription like yours.

If I search Numista for other 1/2 baiocco coins of Innocent XII, I come up empty (likewise if I search on mezzo baiocco in acsearch).

So I think Gubbio is the only option.



Pillar of the Community
Bacchus2's Avatar
United Kingdom
2532 Posts
 Posted 02/13/2025  04:02 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bacchus2 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Thanks very much for those corrections.

Yes - the identification for the Innocent XII 1/2 baiocco fits perfectly. If I'm reading Krause right there should be regnal years on the obverse as well but are, alas, worn off on this example. However if it isn't on Numista I could offer it for an example until a better one comes along.

I do have another ask please. I have this 1823 1/2 Scudo and am researching the various elements on the coat of arms ./ heraldic achievement.

It displays a knight holding a sword in the upmost third (chief), a knight holding a sword in the middle third (fess) and a skull and crossbones in the bottom third (base) but I can't seem to find any reference as to what the skull and crossbones actually represents. It's really quite a neat emblem to have on a coin.

Thanks again for all your help


Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
tdziemia's Avatar
United States
6895 Posts
 Posted 02/14/2025  8:39 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
It is the Pacca family coat of arms on the coin. Bartolomeo Pacca was the cardinal camerlengo who presided over the conclave (and the coinage) during the Sede Vacante of 1823.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartolomeo_Pacca
Above it is the umbraculum which replaces the papal tiara during a sede vacante.

I think the Pacca coat of arms is a sort of riff on the ages of man: a young warrior, an old warrior, and bones (a dead warrior). But you can dig on Pacca heraldry (no pun intended) and probably get a better answer.

Last but not least, that is really a lovely coin.
Edited by tdziemia
02/14/2025 8:43 pm
Pillar of the Community
Bacchus2's Avatar
United Kingdom
2532 Posts
 Posted 02/16/2025  07:43 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Bacchus2 to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I hadn't considered - "the aging of a knight" as the meaning behind the coat of arms. Very good suggestion.

many thanks
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
tdziemia's Avatar
United States
6895 Posts
 Posted 02/16/2025  08:04 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I admit to being pretty ignorant about heraldry, and only reporting what I find elsewhere.

Maybe Italian nobility approached their coats of arms differently than other parts of Europe .

I think the one that shows up most often on Papal States coins is the Medici arms (six balls); Leo X, Clement VII, Pius IV and Leo XI were all from that family.
Pillar of the Community
Learn More...
tdziemia's Avatar
United States
6895 Posts
 Posted 02/18/2025  08:34 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add tdziemia to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
For others who have coins from Papal States, a "gallery" thread has been started on Papal States coins (up to 1870) so as to not hijack this thread.

http://goccf.com/t/476396
  Previous TopicReplies: 27 / Views: 1,106Next Topic
Page: of 2

To participate in the forum you must log in or register.



    




Disclaimer: While a tremendous amount of effort goes into ensuring the accuracy of the information contained in this site, Coin Community assumes no liability for errors. Copyright 2005 - 2025 Coin Community Family- all rights reserved worldwide. Use of any images or content on this website without prior written permission of Coin Community or the original lender is strictly prohibited.
Contact Us  |  Advertise Here  |  Privacy Policy / Terms of Use

Coin Community Forum © 2005 - 2025 Coin Community Forums
It took 0.38 seconds to rattle this change. Forums