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Florin 1853 Varieties

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Author Previous TopicReplies: 7 / Views: 463Next Topic  
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chronos's Avatar
Lebanon
480 Posts
 Posted 01/18/2025  1:23 pm Show Profile   Bookmark this topic Add chronos to your friends list Get a Link to this Message Number of Subscribers
Hello,
Do Uk Florin 1853 has different varieties ? If yes what are they? Thx for help
Edited by chronos
01/19/2025 04:54 am
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NumisRob's Avatar
United Kingdom
16078 Posts
 Posted 01/18/2025  1:39 pm  Show Profile   Check NumisRob's eBay Listings Bookmark this reply Add NumisRob to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Other than the Proof, my 2023 Spink catalogue doesn't list any, nor does my Coincraft catalogue from 2000.
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Spence's Avatar
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32709 Posts
 Posted 01/18/2025  2:00 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Same lack of varieties on numista:

https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces4840.html

@chron, what are you seeing with the coins in hand?
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PaddyB's Avatar
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930 Posts
 Posted 01/18/2025  2:46 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add PaddyB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
ESC indicates two varieties aside from the proof versions. Obverse B1 has the ww below the bust with a stop )doesn't make it clear where) and obverse B2 has no stop. The latter is listed as Common, the former as R3.
Is that what you are seeing?
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chronos's Avatar
Lebanon
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 Posted 01/18/2025  4:09 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chronos to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
Iam seing two small dots : after the date on the obverse next to the bust
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Spence's Avatar
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32709 Posts
 Posted 01/18/2025  7:40 pm  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add Spence to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I think that we could really use some pictures here @chron. Thx for adding them to this thread.
"If you climb a good tree, you get a push."
-----Ghanaian proverb

"The danger we all now face is distinguishing between what is authentic and what is performed."
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chronos's Avatar
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 Posted 01/19/2025  04:56 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add chronos to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I added a pic , it is not very clear because of the resolution , there is a dot between the base of I and bust and one next to the point in i.what do you think?
Edited by chronos
01/20/2025 03:18 am
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PaddyB's Avatar
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930 Posts
 Posted 01/20/2025  05:12 am  Show Profile   Bookmark this reply Add PaddyB to your friends list Get a Link to this Reply
I am aware that Chronos is keen for a response. I have been holding off, because I am no expert on these, and the topic is subject to widely different opinions. A similar query is being discussed on another forum (UK based) with no clear decision one way or another. (I cannot post a link to that discussion as that is forbidden (I believe) on this forum.)
There have been references to an 1853 gothic florin with a stop after the date in several books going back 100 years or so. More recently these have been called into doubt as no one could produce an example to show the feature, and the variety has almost been written off.
In other cases where a stop on other dates appears after the roman numerals, it is level with the base of the last "i" and clearly round. In Chronos's example the stop is irregular and below the line, suggesting a Cud or die flaw rather than an intended stop. The other irregularity at the top of the last "i" lends weight to the idea that they are Cuds.
Having said that, it is possible that coins with similar marks led to the listing of 1853s with a stop after the date in the first place.
The other forum shows a coin with a similar feature at the base of the "i", but not at the top and is clearly a different coin. (Also much more clearly photographed, so easier to assess.)
So, debateable whether this is a definite variety, but some collectors may choose to accept it as it may fill the rare "stop after date" box. Others will simply call it a Cud and so be uninterested.
I hope that helps!
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