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 Replies: 36 / Views: 8,460 |
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
OK, after licking my wounds from my last failure to get PCGS to attribute and recognise the Wedding Set coins as either Proof Like or Specimen strikes I am ready to step into the breach again.
Regardless of the many emails and documentation I have sent them regarding the minting process that included polished blanks and extra pressure used when striking these coins I still failed in my last "sortie" to get these coins correctly attributed.
I know many of you think I am doing a Don Keota and am simply fighting Windmills with this , But I do feel strongly about this and will persist with my efforts regardless.
PCGS prides itself on grading a coin for what it is and just because the RAM didn't call the Wedding Sets a Specimen set is irrelevant.
Even Murphy's Dog can tell that there is a profound difference between a Mint set/Circulating coin and a coin from a Wedding Set so why can't PCGS have some guts and call them for what they really are ?
Any assistance with my Quest would be greatly appreciated. If you can think of a valid reason why these coins should not be attributed for what they are , Say your piece in this thread Ok
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Valued Member
Australia
444 Posts |
*** Edited by Staff to remove YELLING. All capital letters is the internet version of yelling. Please don't do it in titles or posts. ***That is a problem only Chris or Eric can resolve for you with PCGS, but I agree they are specimen coins sorry for the caps I forgot to remove caps lock before postingStaff edit - you could have edited your post to removed the caps
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Pillar of the Community
 Australia
7096 Posts |
Thanks for the support Mate  I have only had 500 odd coins graded by PCGS so I am only a little fish in the pond. If a few of the bigger fish "Anteed Up" then maybe we could get this resolved. Here's Hoping  Edited by trout1105
02/08/2016 01:33 am
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Valued Member
Australia
338 Posts |
They don't look like proofs and they don't look like normal circulating issues so that only leaves specimen/proof-like! I agree with you Trout, call them specimens or proof-like! I'm not sure how you can go about actually proving this though.
From what I've read before on the topic, it comes down to coin's finish. The wedding set coins seems to be much more "Gemmy" than the regular issues but I'm not sure you could convince PCGS that this is a "Specimen" "Proof-like" finish.
I hope they do sort it out, I wouldn't mind a SP designated set of coins myself!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1512 Posts |
I agree with you, they should be SP, not PF or MS. Good luck! Also, Trout, I found a picture of you on the internet, mate! Fighting the good fight: |
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Valued Member
Australia
75 Posts |
Polished dies, polished planchets, struck four times.
Sound like proofs to me.
Certainly if they are predecimals you would call them proofs.
PCGS have made up their minds to call them circulation issues. However you may well get them to designate them as Variety: 'Wedding Set Coin' similar to what they do with the Yaralumla 50c
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
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PCGS have made up their minds to call them circulation issues. However you may well get them to designate them as Variety: 'Wedding Set Coin' similar to what they do with the Yaralumla 50c The Yarralumla coin IS now recognised as a Specimen coin by PCGS. http://www.PCGS.com/pop/valueview.aspx?s=569220
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
In the latest edition of Macdonald's on page 246 describes the Wedding Sets up to 2009 as being a "Specimen Finish" and lists the years from 2002-2009 under the heading of "Following coins are all Specimen Quality". Also when you look at the PCGS population reports for these years you will notice that the grades are higher for these coins than most other years. I have a spare copy of the 22nd edition of Macca's and am thinking of sending it along with a mint set and wedding set from the same year in their original packaging to David Hall at PCGS. This way he can view the coins in hand and the difference in the finish for these coins will be blindingly obvious to him. With the multitude of different coins from around the World that PCGS grades they are probably blissfully unaware that the wedding set coins are a different coin type than the circulating coins for the years 2002-2009, I am hopeful that I will be able to enlighten them. I will include any documentation I can find that shows that these coins have a completely different finish to the circulation coins and that they are indeed Specimen coins . Most Australian collectors consider that these coins are Specimens and it is about time that PCGS did as well and that they grade them accordingly . If anyone has any documentation that can assist me in this endeavour it would be greatly appreciated |
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
This is a scan of the page from McDonalds 22nd edition.  |
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Valued Member
Australia
444 Posts |
keep at them trout and I am sure they will eventually get the SP designation
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
Here are 2 coins as a comparison . First coin is out of the "In come the Dollars, In come the Cents" set. The bottom coin is out of a 2008 Wedding Set. Not too hard to work out that these are 2 completely different coin types This is the coin from the "in come the dollars/cents set" Notice that the fields are a bit "Grainy" and the strike is not super defined. I think this one will grade at MS67 maybe 68 at PCGS  Now look at this 2008 Wedding set coin. Notice the polished and smooth fields also the astonishingly well defined strike. An easy 69 with a shot at 70 at PCGS  |
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
998 Posts |
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keep at them trout and I am sure they will eventually get the SP designation Yeah,but the answer is to get a Oz. based grading Co. with Street Cred.up and running.ANDA could do it if they wanted too,the time is now with the market being flooded with fakes and slabbing numbers at a all time high.
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
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Yeah,but the answer is to get a Oz. based grading Co. with Street Cred.up and running.ANDA could do it if they wanted too,the time is now with the market being flooded with fakes and slabbing numbers at a all time high. We have some eminently qualified people in Aus that can grade just as well as any grader at PCGS But the problem is most of them are successful dealers and it would be a conflict of interest if they were to start up a new grading service.
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
998 Posts |
Yep,but there's a Business opportunity staring people in the face,the time is now whilst Slabbing is on a roll.To be successful it has to have credibility,ANDA could back it and arrange investors with no great Drama,established Coin dealers don't have to be involved but the point I'm making is whoever starts it has to have credibility,ANDA is just an eg,if the Dodgy Bros. Coin Grading starts up we know how its going to go,however if Downies,for another eg, or the like are involved its got a great chance and a real money spinner.
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
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,however if Downies,for another eg, or the like are involved its got a great chance and a real money spinner. Having Downies involved in an Australian TPG would be a vary poor choice IMHO. They already market coins and create their own packaging so there would most defiantly be a conflict of interest there. The startup cost alone for this venture would be rather large and with the way APCGS has "Soured" the concept of an Australian based TPG it would take Years of operating in the Red just to gain a reputation as an honest and accurate TPG. I think the Best we can hope for is for PCGS to open an office in Aus and grade and encapsulate the coins here.
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Pillar of the Community
Australia
7096 Posts |
Here are the 4 different coin types for the Decimal coins . As you can see they are all very different coin types and can easily be distinguished . Circulation/Business strike. struck once on normal blanks. This is an MS coin  Gem Uncirculated strike. Struck twice on normal blanks Also an MS coin but with a stronger strike and an overall "Glossy" appearance, Notice that the fields are somewhat granular. Specimen strike Struck twice ( I was told 4 times) using specially prepared polished blanks. This is a SP coin and the finish is unmistakable Frosted Proof strike Struck 4 times using specially prepared polished blanks This is a PR DCAM coin  Now this is a Specimen Captain Cook coin that was sold in the little red boxes. It is graded SP68 by PCGS and has the same strong strike with the beautiful smooth fields and is of the same overall appearance as the Wedding Set coins,  Edited by trout1105
02/13/2016 8:20 pm
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Replies: 36 / Views: 8,460 |
Posted 02/08/2016 01:32 am
