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 Replies: 53 / Views: 3,979 |
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Bedrock of the Community
 United States
15745 Posts |
Fantastic examples, Joe!
Inordinately fascinated by bits of metal with strange markings and figures
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Pillar of the Community
United States
9754 Posts |
Never seen or heard of these. Beautiful for sure!
How much squash could a Sasquatch squash if a Sasquatch would squash squash? Download and read: Grading the graders Costly TPG ineptitude and No FG Kennedy halveshttps://ln5.sync.com/dl/7ca91bdd0/w...i3b-rbj9fir2 |
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Pillar of the Community
 United States
4905 Posts |
Joewobblie those are all some great looking coins! I love you guilt icon coin and I still want to get a white porcelain coin that is guilt. What is that mint mark on the edge of the coin, is it just a dark spot? You made me get out my non-meissen coin and see if I could find anything on the edge.
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Valued Member
United States
228 Posts |
@chrsmat71 - I am no expert but I have collected and studied these for a few years. Most (perhaps 90%) of the porcelain coins and medals come from Meissen - but there are a few other makers out there. I am pretty sure your non-Miessen one was made in 1923 by Württemberger Majolikawekes Gaildorf (guessing that Wurttenburg is a region and the factory is located in the town of Gaildorf). I often see it in a set of three - white, redish-brown and black. There may be the letters WMW on it somewhere - I can't remember. Yours is a nice one, they tend to have chips around the rim. The one I showed made by the company KPM has that squiggly mark that kind of looks like an arrow. From a google search: "KPM is an acronym for Königliche Porzellan-Manufaktur Berlin, which translates to "Royal Porcelain Factory in Berlin." The company was founded in 1763 by Frederick II of Prussia" It is still in business and makes lots of high end porcelain - again a google search will show lots. Here are two from a company called Teichert (Manufactur Ernst Teichert GmbH). They are not are sharp as the Meissen ones but I just happened to have them within reach      |
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Moderator
United States
157664 Posts |
Excellent examples!  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4905 Posts |
Hey thanks for that info joewobblie, you're right there is a WMW right there on the lower obverse I didn't even notice it. I REALLY like the token with the
u boat obverse, how cool!
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1702 Posts |
How about an SEM/EDS surface analysis targeting the painted on gold type area. Here is the full SURFACE SEM/EDS assay: Au (47.73%), Fe (3.95%), Ca (Ca.65%), Potassium (3.72%), Si (29.64%), Al (11.95%) & Magnesium (1.35%). So for the red types - iron is used. There basic make-up calcium, potassium, silicon, aluminum and magnesium. Real gold is used (painted) on the more desirable ones - and again if reddish its due primarily to the added iron. John Lorenzo, Numismatist, United States. P.S. Check out my new counterfeit site on Facebook CCC-The Good Ones. We discuss metallurgical XRF analyses at least weekly. These are GREAT UNDER-APPRECIATED exonumia types.
Edited by colonialjohn
08/10/2023 2:09 pm
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Moderator
United States
157664 Posts |
Very interesting! |
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Valued Member
United States
228 Posts |
Colonialjohn - Got a question for you. I noticed a seller on ebay who had some porcelain pieces with gold highlights which looked a little too bright. I wondered if the gold coloring was added recently as a way to "enhance" the pieces. Do you think your testing could determine if this is the case by comparing the results from pieces we know are genuine? I don't have any but just curious about the possibility. |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4905 Posts |
Thanks for that colonialjohn, that analysis is interesting! Here is another one I picked up recently, a fundraising token.  The legend around the helmet reads something close to "German war invalid and surviving unit association". |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1702 Posts |
Since the SEM/EDS and XRF analysis measure roughly the top ~10 micrometers of a surface IMO since the application is roughly applied by hand with variable gold thickness at the surface it would not be possible to determine when the gold was applied as these gold numbers are also variable. There is something called a SEM micrograph which looks at the microstructure of a substance - perhaps the gold application has a diagnostic SEM micrograph but this cost and depth of analysis simply is outside the current feasibility of your inquiry.
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Pillar of the Community
United States
4905 Posts |
I've always wanted to pick up one of these green porcelain tokens I think all the coins from this manufacturer (KPM) are green and feature miners.  |
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Pillar of the Community
United States
1702 Posts |
HMMM ... green color. Cu? Interesting. Never seen a green Meissen.
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Moderator
United States
157664 Posts |
Very nice! |
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Valued Member
United States
228 Posts |
@Colonialjohn - thanks for the informative response.
@chrsmat71 - another nice one. KPM made many different porcelain pieces in various colors. They still make them today! I believe the Waldenburg coinage ones have a dark and light green version, and I think there are some blue ones as well.
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Replies: 53 / Views: 3,979 |
First Page
Posted 07/23/2023 8:07 pm
