You can see he has one note with serial number H15A amazingly I know there were even shorter ones out there.
That H15A note is gem uncirculated (65) and is being sold at 1650 Now without knowing the exact serial number (the block matters etc) I can't tell you if the one you have is special but it is unlikely to be particularly so. Hence the value of your note will be mostly dependent on the condition of it rather than the serial number. Again, your note might be something special but its very unlikely.
Obviously if you have number A1 its likely to be through the roof in price but when H1A needs to be supergem to retail at 1650 bucks you can see that the serial number isn't likely to be super important.
I am not an expert in this issue so there might be some amazing thing I am missing but certainly can't say without knowing the actual number.
Looks to me as if there might be some PVC residue also in which case it wouldn't get encapsulated without 'restoration". But maybe I am wrong about the reside as no one else seems to have mentioned it ...
Its looks like a regular luck token of which there are almost infinite varieties. Interesting that it takes the border that is common in the HK trade dollars from C19 using an ancient Greek design.
But the whole machine thing is a problem. Again, unless you are talking about MS69 and MS70 coins which can be properly analyzed by both humans and machines, the machine itself will be SUBJECTIVE. I have spent 30 years working in AI and AI will simply NOT get an objective grade for coins. Why? Because all sorts of things are subject to opinion. Just look at the Morgan dollar that the graders gave a much lower grade than the candidate because they saw fingerprint toning as much more problematic. No machine will be able to objectively assess that stuff - it will need programming. In the same way, people who claim they will use an "objective score" for dings etc...who is to say if a ding is bad or not bad? Sure most people agree that a ding on the cheek of a Morgan is bad, but not ALL do and even then how bad are those dings vs others? AI will at least be consistent (probably - even that is not guaranteed) but consistent vs a programing solution / definition of what the grade should be. So there is not going to be a panacea although AI might at least speed up grading for submitters
I think the grades are basically a guide In the same way that one should treat coins graded by a very poor agency with a lot of salt, those graded by PCGS or NGC still should have a little salt associated with them. I think they DO generally get the grade roughly right, but something like a tone spot for example you don't know if it happened in the holder or before so that MS66 quarter could have been exactly that when it was inserted. Overall, never bet the bank on a slabbed grade. Do your work and figure out what the weaknesses and the strengths of the coin are (they all have them except for manifest MS 69 or 70 moderns) and figure out what you can accept. For me there are certain coins that I can see are legit MS65 but I would only pay MS63 money for them just because of my personal view of the look. I personally do not understand at all why very flashily toned coins command a premium. I happily look to sell anything that can get that premium to switch to the same grade but blast white + some cash. There are others who would really value to toned grades.
Personally I would go with VF. It is possible to just squeeze an XF but the wear particularly on the leaves and bow on the reverse probably won't get you there despite the obverse being of XF grade.
So as I said grade wise I think the rim damage is included in the overall grade. If the rim damage was very bad you would have a details grade but instead it just reduces the overall grade. So assuming that Hondo is right (and I think that he is - I also fell for the illusion a bit) them MS62 is about the right grade for the coin. The rim damage will not stop someone from buying the coin because they will do the same calculus. The coin does look like choice or better in terms of general appearance but the rim has some small amount of damage that compromises the grade. So if you can get this at an AU price then this is undoubtedly great value. Conversely if someone tries to charge you a choice price its a no no unless you need it.
As for varieties here is the currently accepted variety list from pcgs
Now that DOESN'T mean the every single die is accounted for. Some varieties are just not different enough to count, but it should give you enough of an idea. Generally unless the varieties are RARE and explicit they tend not to add any value at all to the regular coin.
Hello To me this looks like a regular penny that has either been electroplated, or more likely dipped in some sort of metallic paint. I do not think this is a different metal planchet The reason for this is that it has very strange marks on the fields indicative of such a thing having happened and they are very clearly not dings or bag marks or anything else that I can think of. Furthermore, it seems as if you can see the original zinc/copper surface coming through at some points in the fields particularly near the date. I don't think this is mint created at all.
With regards to the grading, whilst it may be rim filing, the truth is that it is such a small amount of damage that I would not expect it to prevent the coin being graded.
As for the numbering, it almost certainly would not have been noticed when grading took place. This would be because A) it is faint, and B) because at sub choice for MS, there are expected to be dings and marks like this on coins - but they did not notice that it was deliberate damage.
So overall, yes it should NOT be MS62 because of the graffiti, however I can understand how it got through because the graffiti is very light indeed.
It should be noted that grading agencies often do make mistakes. but I do not believe that the rim issue would have compromised the grade even if noticed because it is too light to be obviously deliberate. Such damage could have come from sovereign money holders/clips etc. and given the limited damage it would usually be ignored for a low MS grade and considered part of regular bag mark type stuff.
this is EXACTLY the same as yours (although it is an AU example) and has the nails technically not attached to the hand Different dies will have slightly different details especially from that period.
As for authenticity, the best thing to do would be to compare the dings etc to the photo from NGC that they took so that you can know if this is the coin that was graded. To me this doesn't look suspicious as a fake however.
What I can say is that, it looks particularly nice for an MS62 despite the things you mentioned so it is likely that the grader looked at it and noted at least the rim damage and adjusted the grade slightly. I do not think the graffiti was noticed but it is very light indeed
Grading agencies DO make mistakes all the time, however this one is very marginal. if you notice it then sure, but I do think this coin will pass for something like MS62 generally. The graffiti is an issue but many people might not even regard it as being graffiti - it could have been due to an imprint from some other coin pressing against it in a money clip for example.
So whatever it is, its not THAT far off being a fair grade and it can arguably be the right grade. At this level of detail nuance is very important.
Finally, it should be noted that even an MS70 grading is technically ONLY flawless at 5X magnification. Any imperfections below that magnification would technically NOT affect a perfect grading.
Oh sorry and yes the deposits in the rim are totally standard and are bits of skin and dust deposited over time. It should be noted that UNC doesn't actually mean it was never circulated as you cannot tell that. What it means is that their is no VISIBLE wear on the coin consistent with circulation. Those are two very different things. There is every reason to expect that this coin WAS circulated for a while before someone collected it but that doesn't in any way mean it is not MS.
Also you appear to have the second variety. This one had the rays between the sword and the man. The one I have does NOT have them, Both varieties are legit but again I just can't get my head over that mushy strike
He is the authority on such stuff and it is from his book that it is mentioned that they were coined such
HOWEVER, the coin you have looks too poor a strike just from your photos to be a genuine coin. I have the silver version of it and it is just beautifully struck. But if someone will know for sure it is him
Okay this is a tricky one. Whilst the period you are looking at is my specialty for Japanese coins, for Chinese it is the republic era hence I am not an expert. However I have or believed I had every single variety of this one and this is different to all the ones that I have, The main difference is that the border ring appears thicker. Having said that, I am not really sure the point of faking such a relatively low value coin is. The dimensions otherwise are fine.
Overall, I would say it could be a fake of some very rare variety that is worth a huge amount of money (or possibly a bad fake of a common variety), but more likely it is genuine and I am just wrong about this not being a standard variety.
Regardless there are a few genuine experts on Qing dynasty coinage in the forum and I am sure they will opine further.
Thanks guys well taken. The way I think about dcam is simply a grade adjustment and I just can't justify the price hike at the moment vs what I can get Namely a regular pf67 vs the dcam version at 10X I just can't justify the price change especially as the one I am looking at seems as though it could slide to cameo even if it doesn't do dcam
Right... but one quick correction. The Chinese characters were always used in Japan - that was their script since it changed from something that looked a LOT like Hebrew more than 1000 years ago. But yes, it was very convenient that they wrote the 1 yen in english (the British empire was the world's biggest economy), and on the reverse they put 1 yen in Chinese script. The meiji Japanese were in awe of the west especially the british empire and the US and were trying also to copy them as much as possible. Japan having been shut for such a long time didn't realize how much tech had improved and so they went full speed into modernizing hence opening the Osaka and then the Tokyo mint etc. I do think they very much appreciated the SF mint stuff - and they did given the US ambassidor a full set of their 1880 proof coinage. That particular set is lost to the mists of time - but to this day when proof coins do appear for meiji (almost all of them are 1880 but there have appeared other years) they are EXTREMELY well bid - like 5k plus for even the LOWLY 1/2 sen
I have been FOREVER looking for a single 1880 proof of any of it (1/2 sen through to 1 yen) but have never found any in the wild so had to buy the couple that I have at full price from Heritage ... :( S And just so you know, the Japanese proofs are INCREDIBLY rare compared to the US proofs.
So to answer DrBurnzy's question. Here is an 1870 1 yen - this is only AU50 but is a type 2 which is quite rare. I posted a toned type 1 which is gorgeous earlier on this thread but I include it again (hope people don't mind)
Anyway, in 1870 they did indeed use the Chinese characters only but interestingly enough they were ALL minted at the San Francisco mint because the Osaka mint was NOT in existence till 1871. In fact the 1870 coins were only issued in 1871 but they have the minting date from the SF mint minting. So technically the 1870 1 yen is a US coin ... not really but cool anyway:)
Now they minted gold 1 yen in 1871 and basically didn't do anything till 1874 when they decided to mint BOTH gold and silver 1yen mostly to compete with the trade dollars because China would ONLY accept silver at the time. So they used english writing with the number of grains and the fineness in it. Ironically just the NEXT year they minted their own trade dollars for 3 years! they were EXACTLY the same as the US trade dollars because the yen were slightly lower weight (due to intially trying to have a weight between the US 1 dollar weights and the US trade dollars.
Hope all that helps.
By the way, I love that 39 50 cents with beautiful violet toning on the british flag otto:)
Posted 12/12/2024 1:54 pm
